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	<title>Comments for Augsburg1530</title>
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	<description>Organizing a grassroots movement to find out why "Issues, Etc." was canceled</description>
	<pubDate>Thu, 24 Jul 2008 16:01:31 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>Comment on Cringe inducing by Beth</title>
		<link>http://augsburg1530.wordpress.com/2008/06/18/cringe-inducing/#comment-3453</link>
		<dc:creator>Beth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Jul 2008 02:56:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://augsburg1530.wordpress.com/?p=231#comment-3453</guid>
		<description>In general, I agree about the Ablaze movement.  As far as I can tell from what I've seen and heard at church, it's just an advertising gimmick.  Blech.

However, Pastor Giese is a very good pastor and evangelist.  He is a very intelligent man, who knows the scripture very well.  His sermons and sunday school lessons are interesting and educational, and he always communicates a clear gospel message.  He is one of the best preachers I have ever heard (and I've heard plenty).  He does not try to act cool or hip or fun in order to get attention.  His jokes are tasteful and natural, not forced.  

If the fire truck is treated as an end in itself - stick the fire truck out front and people will come to church! - then there's a problem.  The fire truck is not an evangelist.  But it CAN be effectively used as a conversation starter, as a billboard, as a way to get some attention.  I trust Pastor Giese to take advantage of the opportunities it offers in a responsible, scriptural manner.

If you object to the idea of using a fire truck as an evangelical tool - fine, you have a right to an opinion - and I can see your point.  But please don't mock Pastor Giese and critique his motives or his faith when you don't even know the man.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In general, I agree about the Ablaze movement.  As far as I can tell from what I&#8217;ve seen and heard at church, it&#8217;s just an advertising gimmick.  Blech.</p>
<p>However, Pastor Giese is a very good pastor and evangelist.  He is a very intelligent man, who knows the scripture very well.  His sermons and sunday school lessons are interesting and educational, and he always communicates a clear gospel message.  He is one of the best preachers I have ever heard (and I&#8217;ve heard plenty).  He does not try to act cool or hip or fun in order to get attention.  His jokes are tasteful and natural, not forced.  </p>
<p>If the fire truck is treated as an end in itself - stick the fire truck out front and people will come to church! - then there&#8217;s a problem.  The fire truck is not an evangelist.  But it CAN be effectively used as a conversation starter, as a billboard, as a way to get some attention.  I trust Pastor Giese to take advantage of the opportunities it offers in a responsible, scriptural manner.</p>
<p>If you object to the idea of using a fire truck as an evangelical tool - fine, you have a right to an opinion - and I can see your point.  But please don&#8217;t mock Pastor Giese and critique his motives or his faith when you don&#8217;t even know the man.</p>
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		<title>Comment on As I was saying . . . by Helen</title>
		<link>http://augsburg1530.wordpress.com/2008/06/30/as-i-was-saying/#comment-3446</link>
		<dc:creator>Helen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Jul 2008 20:58:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://augsburg1530.wordpress.com/?p=237#comment-3446</guid>
		<description>Being on a college campus, where "Spring Break" has quite another connotation, I rather wish they'd thought twice, too.

Yes, it's probably meant to be irony or something, but I've got two close friends and others not so close, on "break" and it's hard to find humor in it.
They don't have the name recognition or support.
More likely, people will say, "What did ~he~ do?

"Sabbatical",..."retirement"... "dismissal of an employee" (as if a called ordained man was equivalent to a janitor!) ...it's all insulting but who cares?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Being on a college campus, where &#8220;Spring Break&#8221; has quite another connotation, I rather wish they&#8217;d thought twice, too.</p>
<p>Yes, it&#8217;s probably meant to be irony or something, but I&#8217;ve got two close friends and others not so close, on &#8220;break&#8221; and it&#8217;s hard to find humor in it.<br />
They don&#8217;t have the name recognition or support.<br />
More likely, people will say, &#8220;What did ~he~ do?</p>
<p>&#8220;Sabbatical&#8221;,&#8230;&#8221;retirement&#8221;&#8230; &#8220;dismissal of an employee&#8221; (as if a called ordained man was equivalent to a janitor!) &#8230;it&#8217;s all insulting but who cares?</p>
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		<title>Comment on Another firing by steadfastlutherans.org &#187; Must Read Commentary from Martin Noland</title>
		<link>http://augsburg1530.wordpress.com/2008/05/12/anothing-firing/#comment-3434</link>
		<dc:creator>steadfastlutherans.org &#187; Must Read Commentary from Martin Noland</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jul 2008 14:02:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://augsburg1530.wordpress.com/?p=178#comment-3434</guid>
		<description>[...] Historical Institute and so is quite familiar with synodical machinations. For details click here Augsburg 1530. He is commenting on Chris Roseborough’s provocative comment which is the 12th  comment on [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Historical Institute and so is quite familiar with synodical machinations. For details click here Augsburg 1530. He is commenting on Chris Roseborough’s provocative comment which is the 12th  comment on [...]</p>
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		<title>Comment on Comment line is open! by sumbody</title>
		<link>http://augsburg1530.wordpress.com/2008/06/21/comment-line-is-open/#comment-3433</link>
		<dc:creator>sumbody</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jul 2008 13:16:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://augsburg1530.wordpress.com/?p=234#comment-3433</guid>
		<description>This is  a good topic for Todd to cover on the New Issues Non Lutherans preaching from an LCMS pulpit.  Was it a sermon or an announcemet?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is  a good topic for Todd to cover on the New Issues Non Lutherans preaching from an LCMS pulpit.  Was it a sermon or an announcemet?</p>
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		<title>Comment on They&#8217;re reading petition names! by Helen</title>
		<link>http://augsburg1530.wordpress.com/2008/06/30/theyre-reading-petition-names/#comment-3428</link>
		<dc:creator>Helen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jul 2008 01:18:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://augsburg1530.wordpress.com/?p=239#comment-3428</guid>
		<description>It's OK.  I did that; it worked.  
And now I've got a local source of advice if it gives me trouble.  
Thanks for the encouragement!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s OK.  I did that; it worked.<br />
And now I&#8217;ve got a local source of advice if it gives me trouble.<br />
Thanks for the encouragement!</p>
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		<title>Comment on Cringe inducing by Anonymous 1138</title>
		<link>http://augsburg1530.wordpress.com/2008/06/18/cringe-inducing/#comment-3425</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous 1138</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jul 2008 17:13:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://augsburg1530.wordpress.com/?p=231#comment-3425</guid>
		<description>Put a fireman's hat on Jesus.  He rescues us from Ablaze.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Put a fireman&#8217;s hat on Jesus.  He rescues us from Ablaze.</p>
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		<title>Comment on As I was saying . . . by Tim Kuehn</title>
		<link>http://augsburg1530.wordpress.com/2008/06/30/as-i-was-saying/#comment-3419</link>
		<dc:creator>Tim Kuehn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jul 2008 23:25:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://augsburg1530.wordpress.com/?p=237#comment-3419</guid>
		<description>Anon - I sent a comment in, but I presume they see this blog as well. 

Believe it or not, the greater tragedy isn't that these pastors are displaced from their Call, because that's been the fate of God's followers over the centuries, up to and including martydom. 

&lt;i&gt;Beloved, do not be surprised at the fiery trial when it comes upon you to test you, as though something strange were happening to you. But rejoice insofar as you share Christ?s sufferings, that you may also rejoice and be glad when his glory is revealed. If you are insulted for the name of Christ, you are blessed, because the Spirit of glory and of God rests upon you. ... Yet if anyone suffers as a Christian, let him not be ashamed, but let him glorify God in that name. For it is time for judgment to begin at the household of God; and if it begins with us, what will be the outcome for those who do not obey the gospel of God? And

"If the righteous is scarcely saved,what will become of the ungodly
and the sinner?"

Therefore let those who suffer according to God's will entrust their souls to a faithful Creator while doing good. 1 Peter 4:12&lt;/i&gt;

What's the greater tragedy is what'll happen to all the people who either caused these firings, or are in positions of authority and power and do nothing to stop this kind of nonsense. Scripture is quite clear that everyone will give account for what they've done, and all the political tactics and double-speak that happen when a Pastor is driven from where God has placed him won't do these perpetrators a lick of good. 

Scripture describes this kind of behavior, and where it comes from: 

&lt;i&gt;"They will put you out of the synagogues. Indeed, the hour is coming when whoever kills you will think he is offering service to God. And they will do these things because they have not known the Father, nor me. John 16:2"&lt;/i&gt;

Now, if someone doesn't know the Father, or Christ - that can only mean they're condemned. 

This is pretty scary stuff, and as a topic it should be treated as such.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Anon - I sent a comment in, but I presume they see this blog as well. </p>
<p>Believe it or not, the greater tragedy isn&#8217;t that these pastors are displaced from their Call, because that&#8217;s been the fate of God&#8217;s followers over the centuries, up to and including martydom. </p>
<p><i>Beloved, do not be surprised at the fiery trial when it comes upon you to test you, as though something strange were happening to you. But rejoice insofar as you share Christ?s sufferings, that you may also rejoice and be glad when his glory is revealed. If you are insulted for the name of Christ, you are blessed, because the Spirit of glory and of God rests upon you. &#8230; Yet if anyone suffers as a Christian, let him not be ashamed, but let him glorify God in that name. For it is time for judgment to begin at the household of God; and if it begins with us, what will be the outcome for those who do not obey the gospel of God? And</p>
<p>&#8220;If the righteous is scarcely saved,what will become of the ungodly<br />
and the sinner?&#8221;</p>
<p>Therefore let those who suffer according to God&#8217;s will entrust their souls to a faithful Creator while doing good. 1 Peter 4:12</i></p>
<p>What&#8217;s the greater tragedy is what&#8217;ll happen to all the people who either caused these firings, or are in positions of authority and power and do nothing to stop this kind of nonsense. Scripture is quite clear that everyone will give account for what they&#8217;ve done, and all the political tactics and double-speak that happen when a Pastor is driven from where God has placed him won&#8217;t do these perpetrators a lick of good. </p>
<p>Scripture describes this kind of behavior, and where it comes from: </p>
<p><i>&#8220;They will put you out of the synagogues. Indeed, the hour is coming when whoever kills you will think he is offering service to God. And they will do these things because they have not known the Father, nor me. John 16:2&#8243;</i></p>
<p>Now, if someone doesn&#8217;t know the Father, or Christ - that can only mean they&#8217;re condemned. </p>
<p>This is pretty scary stuff, and as a topic it should be treated as such.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Cringe inducing by Pr. (RET) M'art</title>
		<link>http://augsburg1530.wordpress.com/2008/06/18/cringe-inducing/#comment-3418</link>
		<dc:creator>Pr. (RET) M'art</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jul 2008 20:16:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://augsburg1530.wordpress.com/?p=231#comment-3418</guid>
		<description>(posted by request)
Go away for a few weeks and you miss all the good stuff…but really.  Come on folks.  

Okay, so a congregation gets a fire truck.  So the pastor it trying to use it in a positive way.  So they hope that something novel will spur interest and get some conversations started.  So they hope that God will see fit to use the truck to create a chance to speak the Word to someone who might not normally hear it.  Get over it.
 
Personally, I love the fact that they are using a FIRETRUCK for Ablaze.  Hello!  A blaze is a fire.  What do fire trucks do?  They put out fires.  HA! I love it!  Have none of you even seen this.  Intending to or not, this guy has made more of a statement about Ablaze than any of your best blogs will ever do!  Holy smokes folks, not one of you even put that together did you?
 
Look.  I might not have done the fire truck thing (though it is a very interesting idea), but I must say that I respect that they are doing something.  Try re-reading Matthew 28.  
 
First, Jesus has the authority to issue instructions.  Second, he issues them.  Third, He says "GO" and make disciples.  He does not say "sit and wait" to make disciples.  Fourth, the Lord makes it clear that we have a part in what is done.  The work is God's, but He sends us into the fields to work them.  Fifth, He tells us to teach; more action.  Sixth, He makes it clear that He is not leaving us to our own devices, but rather He will be with us as we labor in the fields that He owns, has planted, and will harvest.  Please note the references to Matthew 9.
 
We have heard a lot of innuendo and anecdotes about how outreach doesn't work.  There seems to be a lot of experts on what does not work on this blog, but none that are saying that they are actively following Jesus' instructions "GO" (with the exception of the firetruck).  The truth is that some things don't work and some things do.  When something is done with prayerful thought and consideration, when the focus is Christ driven, and when we permit the Holy Spirit to work, God brings people to faith.  And yes, that one soul that Rev. Giese mentions is worth the effort.  We are told that there is great rejoicing in heaven when one of the lost comes to faith.  Please, don't make the same mistakes that Ablaze is making by focusing upon numbers.
 
Now is there anything wrong with the fire truck.  If you answer truthfully, you'll say "No".  So long as no one has the crazy idea that the truck itself is somehow doing the work that Jesus has given us.  
 
Is it gimmicky?  Yes, absolutely.  So what.  Every program intended to appeal to outsiders is gimmicky –from that nursery the church has hoping to appeal to young people with kids to the Christmas tree lot run by the men's group.  And if I did not mention your churches gimmick think for a moment and you'll realize that you've got at least one.
 
The only issue is that the truck might somehow become the center of attention in place of Christ.  There, we need to trust this pastor, our Lutheran theology, our Lutheran education, and most importantly trust God that He will protect His Church.  After all, when it is said and done, God will either use this and bless it or He will not.  If He does not, you'll never hear about the fire truck again.  If He does, you might be seeing a lot of them.  In your zeal for the Lord, don't box Him in or degrade what He and He alone is capable of doing.
 
Pr. M'art</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>(posted by request)<br />
Go away for a few weeks and you miss all the good stuff…but really.  Come on folks.  </p>
<p>Okay, so a congregation gets a fire truck.  So the pastor it trying to use it in a positive way.  So they hope that something novel will spur interest and get some conversations started.  So they hope that God will see fit to use the truck to create a chance to speak the Word to someone who might not normally hear it.  Get over it.</p>
<p>Personally, I love the fact that they are using a FIRETRUCK for Ablaze.  Hello!  A blaze is a fire.  What do fire trucks do?  They put out fires.  HA! I love it!  Have none of you even seen this.  Intending to or not, this guy has made more of a statement about Ablaze than any of your best blogs will ever do!  Holy smokes folks, not one of you even put that together did you?</p>
<p>Look.  I might not have done the fire truck thing (though it is a very interesting idea), but I must say that I respect that they are doing something.  Try re-reading Matthew 28.  </p>
<p>First, Jesus has the authority to issue instructions.  Second, he issues them.  Third, He says &#8220;GO&#8221; and make disciples.  He does not say &#8220;sit and wait&#8221; to make disciples.  Fourth, the Lord makes it clear that we have a part in what is done.  The work is God&#8217;s, but He sends us into the fields to work them.  Fifth, He tells us to teach; more action.  Sixth, He makes it clear that He is not leaving us to our own devices, but rather He will be with us as we labor in the fields that He owns, has planted, and will harvest.  Please note the references to Matthew 9.</p>
<p>We have heard a lot of innuendo and anecdotes about how outreach doesn&#8217;t work.  There seems to be a lot of experts on what does not work on this blog, but none that are saying that they are actively following Jesus&#8217; instructions &#8220;GO&#8221; (with the exception of the firetruck).  The truth is that some things don&#8217;t work and some things do.  When something is done with prayerful thought and consideration, when the focus is Christ driven, and when we permit the Holy Spirit to work, God brings people to faith.  And yes, that one soul that Rev. Giese mentions is worth the effort.  We are told that there is great rejoicing in heaven when one of the lost comes to faith.  Please, don&#8217;t make the same mistakes that Ablaze is making by focusing upon numbers.</p>
<p>Now is there anything wrong with the fire truck.  If you answer truthfully, you&#8217;ll say &#8220;No&#8221;.  So long as no one has the crazy idea that the truck itself is somehow doing the work that Jesus has given us.  </p>
<p>Is it gimmicky?  Yes, absolutely.  So what.  Every program intended to appeal to outsiders is gimmicky –from that nursery the church has hoping to appeal to young people with kids to the Christmas tree lot run by the men&#8217;s group.  And if I did not mention your churches gimmick think for a moment and you&#8217;ll realize that you&#8217;ve got at least one.</p>
<p>The only issue is that the truck might somehow become the center of attention in place of Christ.  There, we need to trust this pastor, our Lutheran theology, our Lutheran education, and most importantly trust God that He will protect His Church.  After all, when it is said and done, God will either use this and bless it or He will not.  If He does not, you&#8217;ll never hear about the fire truck again.  If He does, you might be seeing a lot of them.  In your zeal for the Lord, don&#8217;t box Him in or degrade what He and He alone is capable of doing.</p>
<p>Pr. M&#8217;art</p>
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		<title>Comment on Comment line is open! by Anonymous 1138</title>
		<link>http://augsburg1530.wordpress.com/2008/06/21/comment-line-is-open/#comment-3417</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous 1138</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jul 2008 17:54:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://augsburg1530.wordpress.com/?p=234#comment-3417</guid>
		<description>Arlington Heights, IL?  where I saw a non-Lutheran lay person preaching from an LCMS pulpit last September?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Arlington Heights, IL?  where I saw a non-Lutheran lay person preaching from an LCMS pulpit last September?</p>
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		<title>Comment on As I was saying . . . by Anonymous 1138</title>
		<link>http://augsburg1530.wordpress.com/2008/06/30/as-i-was-saying/#comment-3416</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous 1138</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jul 2008 17:45:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://augsburg1530.wordpress.com/?p=237#comment-3416</guid>
		<description>Tim,
Good concerns.  I'm beginning to wonder if it wasn't meant to be making light on a situation, but more deliberately a tongue-in-cheek, sarcastic remark intended for those who already misuse the terms.
I know one LCMS pastor who was fired, while the powers and their minions called it a "sabbatical."  He's played along with it and got himself another call; and now tries to keep a low profile.
I know another LCMS pastor who was fired, while the powers and their minions called it a "retirement."  He's now been an itinerant preacher without a call since 2005.
These powers and their minions clearly mock the entire concept of a "call."
Issues, Etc has an email address for comments and concerns now:  talkback@issuesetc.org  We know what to do!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tim,<br />
Good concerns.  I&#8217;m beginning to wonder if it wasn&#8217;t meant to be making light on a situation, but more deliberately a tongue-in-cheek, sarcastic remark intended for those who already misuse the terms.<br />
I know one LCMS pastor who was fired, while the powers and their minions called it a &#8220;sabbatical.&#8221;  He&#8217;s played along with it and got himself another call; and now tries to keep a low profile.<br />
I know another LCMS pastor who was fired, while the powers and their minions called it a &#8220;retirement.&#8221;  He&#8217;s now been an itinerant preacher without a call since 2005.<br />
These powers and their minions clearly mock the entire concept of a &#8220;call.&#8221;<br />
Issues, Etc has an email address for comments and concerns now:  <a href="mailto:talkback@issuesetc.org">talkback@issuesetc.org</a>  We know what to do!</p>
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